Buff Magical Chieftain and Rework Physical Chieftain!

[Theweasel 161]

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

Haha, the attributes of the whole body accessories are all chiefs with physical attacks as the main attribute, you told me that this is a half-blood chieftain, this is the biggest joke, think about why he doesn't spend his points on spell attack skills, but on physical single skills

Im sure that magical damage is not only Decorative. 

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

 

Unlike the Beastmaster, the Beastmaster must be built with magic in order to have a strong recovery ability, and I don't have much of a problem with the recovery ability of the Magic Chief, but don't you think it's funny if you compare a physically constructed recovery skill with a spell-built recovery skill now? Isn't the biggest imbalance in the physical regeneration skills that can be compared to the regeneration skills in the spell builds?

Beastmaster doesnt lose anything Despite being only having magic damage, still have strong damage/aoe etc,  while chief sacrifices some skills Depending on build. 

Maybe only mixed chief has a bit of everything

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

While this is just a discussion of healing, don't forget that the Chieftain is a combination of healing, damage reduction, and resistance, and the Beastmaster is not yet comparable to the Chief

What it lacks in resistance , it has in excess in healing.  Why does bm needs that amount of healing skills in first place? 

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

 

Well, yes, they need a lot of survivability, so may I ask, which of them has a stronger class recovery than the chief in the video? The Rogue, who had the worst survivability, did not gain the same recovery as the Chief, and the Chieftain still had hides, and the Thieves had nothing. In the current version, with the introduction of talents, the Chieftain can also gain a lot of mana while building physics, and trying this healing skill that is supposed to serve spells can also be very useful in physical construction.

Ofc rogues need a good defensive skill, but  It's not the chief's fault in having a defensive skill that the rogue doesn't. 

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

Why is it that among so many orc classes, only the orc chieftain is so broken?

 books makes all classes broken in their own way,  dont expect all classes doin the same as chief. 

3 hours ago, weakplay said:

All classes are different, but that doesn't mean you can have such a huge advantage. At least the positioning of the profession is the same, both are DMGs

I honestly don't know what to tell you buddy.. tell them to stop using cheap buffs, to fight honestly? 

 

Nerfing all chief is not the solution,  strong booked chieftains will still be there. 

Eventually y'all will keep asking to nerf  every thing you find broken To the point of rendering it totally useless, as happened with the poor rogues. 

Edited November 25, 2023 by Lilweasel

[Khrone 648]

35 minutes ago, Lilweasel said:

Beastmaster doesnt lose anything Despite being only having magic damage, still have strong damage/aoe etc,  while chief sacrifices some skills Depending on build. 

To be honest, the physical build of the Beastmaster is pretty bad 

Edited November 25, 2023 by Khrone

[Theweasel 161]

1 hour ago, Khrone said:

To be honest, the physical build of the Beastmaster is pretty bad 

There is no other good reason to going physical build than only for the beast damage. When magical build also contributes on beast damage, plus gain healing skills + aoe. 

 

It's just foolishly losing important skills  for a little more damage. 

[Sandels 8]

Slightly late but this seems to still be a hot topic so,

 

On 11/15/2023 at 10:02 PM, Jaan said:

magic chief is made for mass fights, not for arena. if you want to be good in arena, go for physical set. The Damage a magic chief does in gvg/mass fights is way too high and you want more of it, you clearly are a chief user right?





you want more damage than this? this is just from one chieftain. Now imagine theres more than 30 of them with their stacked aoe and you are asking for more?

 

Correct me if i'm wrong but i believe that is an old video meaning no bracelets nor talents which both made a big difference already to overall balance, bracelets balanced the dmg from chief and mage and other magic stuff a reasonable amount already. I myself play a chief and stopped using magic setup after all the recent additions cause i personally feel it lacking compared to more physical dmg focus for various reasons, atleast for my builds. Also i believe that is an orci chieftain and overall booked therefore its unrealistic showcase of the dmg and effectiveness they have in reality but people seem to like putting the almighty orci chiefs in every argument and example they post. But something one should consider is that while mc side might have more aoe dmg, debuffs and dots and such, elf side also has better tools to counter them. Elves got better support and heals and etc which is quite logical in the end if you think of it. More dmg, dots and debuffs vs more support, heals and such to make it +-0 dont you think? So it cant really be so black and white that oh, this mc class has more dmg than elf ones, not taking into consideration that due to them having perhaps more dmg, you have more tools to counter the dmg, unlike mc side that has less counters to dmg for example (apart from perhaps dmg reduction skills, those also being single target), therefore if elves had the same amount of dmg, dots and debuffs, theyd have to also give mc classes the tools to counter them the same way elves have.

On 11/24/2023 at 5:32 PM, vavavi said:

 

Phys chiefs have extremely high single target burst, idk what this is about. On top of the burst they just also passive apply high damage bleeds to anyone who happens to even get close.

The bleed talent is what made it go high with the guaranteed 1st hit bleed and increased applying chances everytime it doesn't apply it. Before you had your 1 burst and after that you had nothing for the next 10 seconds, now atleast you got a couple bleeds more going on. While i agree chiefs got good burst dmg, its quite logical imo cause it comes with the lack of stun. Of course paired with a stunner you get hurt but thats not the case with chief only, the same way a bd, seeker, reaper or any dmg class kills you fast if youre stunned and unable to react, if theyre also built for dmg the same way the chief might be.

 

Where i want to argue though is that while some would say the dmg is high, in the end what value does it bring when you arent stunned and are free to counter it in many ways (exceptions being ranger and mage in elf side cause theyre just bad matchups vs chief due to lack of support and barrier being not so good vs any smart chief). If youre somewhat equal strength in terms of equips and such with the chief youre fighting with, you will survive and have time for you and your team to do whats neccessary, i mean even your priest can tank a booked orci chief for a very long time unless it gets a couple lucky stuns from % or apathy relic proc at a good time or you screw up something, yes as a priest you wont kill a chief but thats not really your job, balanced 1v1s in this game are long gone and changes should have nothing to do with 1v1 unless its completely gamebreaking, which in chief case its not due to them (even orci ones) still having counters like bd and even seeker with the right setup and witnessed them die to pretty much every class that has proper stuns nor dmg with just slight luck with relics and such.

 

Lets be real, anywhere you go the only chiefs people complain about are the very few orci chiefs. Yes orci chiefs are strong but theyre not unbeatable if you have a good team and quite frankly, with a bit of gamesense as to when your team uses their stuns and other skills and perhaps positioning, its really not that hard to kill a chief if you got them in a 2v1 or especially like in all these vids with "full team" and whatever, the reason they lose is coz they see oh haha 1v5 lets just mindlessly spam skills and not care about anything while being alot weaker than the chief in terms or equips and amps and such. Seen mages, bds, bm, even palas and other classes kill multiple people due to the enemies just getting cocky and then messing up. I would agree orci chief is arguably the hardest match but ive seen people deal with them with ease, just requires a brain. If you happen to end up in a 1v1 scenario with an orci chief, you better magically transform into a bd or other counter class or youll have a hard time.

 

 

Now for more general stuff, biggest complaints are rugged and resist and with all the tools we got nowadays, Cooldowns going through the roof for every class etc, many skills are found particularly strong. I dont see a problem with rugged really, yes dmg reduction is a big thing in this game but with all the talents and perma rugged and all the tools, you still get killed through it very easily if the enemies just focus you even a little bit. Any proper dmg class can still tear you apart through rugged in matter of seconds. You heal and youre back up, cool. But you cant outheal the dmg for long unless youre a completely maxed out orci chief facing low dmg classes. You see all these vids around of chiefs tanking, but where is the dmg? It would take 1 proper dmg class in addition to any of those vids and the chiefs would die in seconds.

 

Having a near permanent resist when youre buffed to the skies is quite good indeed, even though the % does go down every 2s and eventually youll be at like 40-50% before recasting (on resist buffs and high base resist from guild and enchants etc), so you can still get stunned fairly easy especially if theres more than 1 enemy, but it is one of the key features of the class so changing it should be done with caution.

 

As for actual changes, simply removing the extra time from cleansed debuffs would make a reasonable change already due to there then being a gap between resists, yea sure then few people would just boost their CD even higher and higher to try to close the gap as much as possible but oh well, atleast theyd be 50/50 with mage in that sense and losing other stats to get that CD.

 

Theres really no point in changing rugged cause everyone knows that when rugged goes off with you being stunned or such and cant use it again, you will die instantly and theres no way out of it. The class relies completely on that 1 skill with resist and such just making it easier to reuse it. Additionally it only takes one proper dmg class to hit a chief and it will melt even with rugged on in no time. Low dmg classes will not kill chief the same way they will not kill anything else that can heal or tank even a little, thats just the way it is in the game right now, deal with it or make a better class for that purpose. If anything, you could make rugged give like 50-55% dmg reduction but remove the increase based on how much hp youve lost, that way theyd be easier to nuke. Currently at 30% hp remaining, they have 62% dmg reduction and up to like 70% when going lower which makes it difficult to finish them off unless you have high dmg.

 

But they heal so much! Well, if i heal 800 (1300 crit) hp with a 5/5 heal with a physical build with reasonable magic and being non buffed, but with relics, castle buffs, castle heal pots, normal buff pots and scrolls and whatever other buffs one can have, i can make it heal 5k+ total with crits, what can i say, they give all those boosts to people so might aswell use them. Heals in general have gone to extreme to the point where having max level heals on certain classes and builds is a waste due to your max hp not being able to keep up when you heal to pretty much full hp without even a crit. So i dont think this is a chief problem csuse alot of classes can do the same, bd for example can aswell heal like 10k hp in few seconds during mark on buffs. Even the lowest of heals nowadays can be turned into high amount with all the boosts we have.

 

The "tankiness" chief has in big fights comes purely from aoe dmg + lifesteal and killing enemies which triggers rage and guild fury effects (hp regen over time), so logically with a class having high amounts of aoe, you will usually get a kill every now and then from your aoe finishing off low hp enemies to grant you those boosts. Problem is not the dmg itself, its the fact that it is constant therefore giving contant lifesteal. This could be affected by turning swooping army into a single hit doing more dmg or something, but would it then be too strong for small fights due to having more nuke power, i don't know.

 

Dmg.

I dont think the dmg needs any adjustment for reasons and possible changes i mentioned above, i think by slightly nerfing the resist and/or rugged, chiefs will be less likely to be able to just run through everything and spam endless dmg to you. Also because chief is the only class (perhaps physical charmer aswell if facing low dmg classes that cant kill the dogs easily) that even has enough dmg to deal with elf classes that are even somewhat tanky or can heal 

 

In general, chief is in a weird spot cause its the reason mc side is somewhat okay. Chief is the only proper source of aoe dmg and/or stagger and a little control without having to fear for your life to be taken in 0.5 seconds if you make even a slight mistake, if those were taken away, theyd have to give them to some other class. Its been a long time since ive seen any other class have any chances vs elves in arenas or other pvp stuff except chief. Its one, if not the only counter to alot of elf classes therefore nerfing chief too much leaves the mc side no way to deal with elves. If they nerf chief, theyll have to give other mc classes better tools to fight elves, simple as that. Like, i dont think theres another class in mc side that can do anything to many of elf classes except chief. You got people saying "all you see is chiefs", well the reason for that is very simple: its the only class that has any counterplay to elf classes, other classes just die. You see in all these times in 5x5, the whole mc team dies in a blink and whats remaining? A chief (although non orci chiefs still die quick and pretty much all the vids you see around where they refuse to die easy are orci chiefs). Is that because chief is broken or is that because the rest of mc classes simply have no tools to fight and chief being the only class that can put up a fight and there must be atleast some sort of counterplay to the opposite side. Should the chiefs die in 2 seconds like the rest of mc classes for elves to win everything without effort, i dont think so.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Sandels

[vavavi 240]

5 hours ago, Sandels said:

Slightly late but this seems to still be a hot topic so,

 

Correct me if i'm wrong but i believe that is an old video meaning no bracelets nor talents which both made a big difference already to overall balance, bracelets balanced the dmg from chief and mage and other magic stuff a reasonable amount already. I myself play a chief and stopped using magic setup after all the recent additions cause i personally feel it lacking compared to more physical dmg focus for various reasons, atleast for my builds. Also i believe that is an orci chieftain and overall booked therefore its unrealistic showcase of the dmg and effectiveness they have in reality but people seem to like putting the almighty orci chiefs in every argument and example they post. But something one should consider is that while mc side might have more aoe dmg, debuffs and dots and such, elf side also has better tools to counter them. Elves got better support and heals and etc which is quite logical in the end if you think of it. More dmg, dots and debuffs vs more support, heals and such to make it +-0 dont you think? So it cant really be so black and white that oh, this mc class has more dmg than elf ones, not taking into consideration that due to them having perhaps more dmg, you have more tools to counter the dmg, unlike mc side that has less counters to dmg for example (apart from perhaps dmg reduction skills, those also being single target), therefore if elves had the same amount of dmg, dots and debuffs, theyd have to also give mc classes the tools to counter them the same way elves have.

The bleed talent is what made it go high with the guaranteed 1st hit bleed and increased applying chances everytime it doesn't apply it. Before you had your 1 burst and after that you had nothing for the next 10 seconds, now atleast you got a couple bleeds more going on. While i agree chiefs got good burst dmg, its quite logical imo cause it comes with the lack of stun. Of course paired with a stunner you get hurt but thats not the case with chief only, the same way a bd, seeker, reaper or any dmg class kills you fast if youre stunned and unable to react, if theyre also built for dmg the same way the chief might be.

 

Where i want to argue though is that while some would say the dmg is high, in the end what value does it bring when you arent stunned and are free to counter it in many ways (exceptions being ranger and mage in elf side cause theyre just bad matchups vs chief due to lack of support and barrier being not so good vs any smart chief). If youre somewhat equal strength in terms of equips and such with the chief youre fighting with, you will survive and have time for you and your team to do whats neccessary, i mean even your priest can tank a booked orci chief for a very long time unless it gets a couple lucky stuns from % or apathy relic proc at a good time or you screw up something, yes as a priest you wont kill a chief but thats not really your job, balanced 1v1s in this game are long gone and changes should have nothing to do with 1v1 unless its completely gamebreaking, which in chief case its not due to them (even orci ones) still having counters like bd and even seeker with the right setup and witnessed them die to pretty much every class that has proper stuns nor dmg with just slight luck with relics and such.

 

Lets be real, anywhere you go the only chiefs people complain about are the very few orci chiefs. Yes orci chiefs are strong but theyre not unbeatable if you have a good team and quite frankly, with a bit of gamesense as to when your team uses their stuns and other skills and perhaps positioning, its really not that hard to kill a chief if you got them in a 2v1 or especially like in all these vids with "full team" and whatever, the reason they lose is coz they see oh haha 1v5 lets just mindlessly spam skills and not care about anything while being alot weaker than the chief in terms or equips and amps and such. Seen mages, bds, bm, even palas and other classes kill multiple people due to the enemies just getting cocky and then messing up. I would agree orci chief is arguably the hardest match but ive seen people deal with them with ease, just requires a brain. If you happen to end up in a 1v1 scenario with an orci chief, you better magically transform into a bd or other counter class or youll have a hard time.

 

 

Now for more general stuff, biggest complaints are rugged and resist and with all the tools we got nowadays, Cooldowns going through the roof for every class etc, many skills are found particularly strong. I dont see a problem with rugged really, yes dmg reduction is a big thing in this game but with all the talents and perma rugged and all the tools, you still get killed through it very easily if the enemies just focus you even a little bit. Any proper dmg class can still tear you apart through rugged in matter of seconds. You heal and youre back up, cool. But you cant outheal the dmg for long unless youre a completely maxed out orci chief facing low dmg classes. You see all these vids around of chiefs tanking, but where is the dmg? It would take 1 proper dmg class in addition to any of those vids and the chiefs would die in seconds.

 

Having a near permanent resist when youre buffed to the skies is quite good indeed, even though the % does go down every 2s and eventually youll be at like 40-50% before recasting (on resist buffs and high base resist from guild and enchants etc), so you can still get stunned fairly easy especially if theres more than 1 enemy, but it is one of the key features of the class so changing it should be done with caution.

 

As for actual changes, simply removing the extra time from cleansed debuffs would make a reasonable change already due to there then being a gap between resists, yea sure then few people would just boost their CD even higher and higher to try to close the gap as much as possible but oh well, atleast theyd be 50/50 with mage in that sense and losing other stats to get that CD.

 

Theres really no point in changing rugged cause everyone knows that when rugged goes off with you being stunned or such and cant use it again, you will die instantly and theres no way out of it. The class relies completely on that 1 skill with resist and such just making it easier to reuse it. Additionally it only takes one proper dmg class to hit a chief and it will melt even with rugged on in no time. Low dmg classes will not kill chief the same way they will not kill anything else that can heal or tank even a little, thats just the way it is in the game right now, deal with it or make a better class for that purpose. If anything, you could make rugged give like 50-55% dmg reduction but remove the increase based on how much hp youve lost, that way theyd be easier to nuke. Currently at 30% hp remaining, they have 62% dmg reduction and up to like 70% when going lower which makes it difficult to finish them off unless you have high dmg.

 

But they heal so much! Well, if i heal 800 (1300 crit) hp with a 5/5 heal with a physical build with reasonable magic and being non buffed, but with relics, castle buffs, castle heal pots, normal buff pots and scrolls and whatever other buffs one can have, i can make it heal 5k+ total with crits, what can i say, they give all those boosts to people so might aswell use them. Heals in general have gone to extreme to the point where having max level heals on certain classes and builds is a waste due to your max hp not being able to keep up when you heal to pretty much full hp without even a crit. So i dont think this is a chief problem csuse alot of classes can do the same, bd for example can aswell heal like 10k hp in few seconds during mark on buffs. Even the lowest of heals nowadays can be turned into high amount with all the boosts we have.

 

The "tankiness" chief has in big fights comes purely from aoe dmg + lifesteal and killing enemies which triggers rage and guild fury effects (hp regen over time), so logically with a class having high amounts of aoe, you will usually get a kill every now and then from your aoe finishing off low hp enemies to grant you those boosts. Problem is not the dmg itself, its the fact that it is constant therefore giving contant lifesteal. This could be affected by turning swooping army into a single hit doing more dmg or something, but would it then be too strong for small fights due to having more nuke power, i don't know.

 

Dmg.

I dont think the dmg needs any adjustment for reasons and possible changes i mentioned above, i think by slightly nerfing the resist and/or rugged, chiefs will be less likely to be able to just run through everything and spam endless dmg to you. Also because chief is the only class (perhaps physical charmer aswell if facing low dmg classes that cant kill the dogs easily) that even has enough dmg to deal with elf classes that are even somewhat tanky or can heal 

 

In general, chief is in a weird spot cause its the reason mc side is somewhat okay. Chief is the only proper source of aoe dmg and/or stagger and a little control without having to fear for your life to be taken in 0.5 seconds if you make even a slight mistake, if those were taken away, theyd have to give them to some other class. Its been a long time since ive seen any other class have any chances vs elves in arenas or other pvp stuff except chief. Its one, if not the only counter to alot of elf classes therefore nerfing chief too much leaves the mc side no way to deal with elves. If they nerf chief, theyll have to give other mc classes better tools to fight elves, simple as that. Like, i dont think theres another class in mc side that can do anything to many of elf classes except chief. You got people saying "all you see is chiefs", well the reason for that is very simple: its the only class that has any counterplay to elf classes, other classes just die. You see in all these times in 5x5, the whole mc team dies in a blink and whats remaining? A chief (although non orci chiefs still die quick and pretty much all the vids you see around where they refuse to die easy are orci chiefs). Is that because chief is broken or is that because the rest of mc classes simply have no tools to fight and chief being the only class that can put up a fight and there must be atleast some sort of counterplay to the opposite side. Should the chiefs die in 2 seconds like the rest of mc classes for elves to win everything without effort, i dont think so.

You're looking at every skill individually. Yes, if you look at one skill or aspect of the class at a time there is no issue. The issue is the combination from all of these.

 

Just having long dmg redu and resist on demand is extremely strong. At the very least that ends in either being permanently immune to stuns, or on massive dmg reduction. Once you add those 2 in combination with the ability to heal (which already interacts way too strongly with resilience relic due to rugged ensuring survivability at those low hps), strong damage, movement speed and having an aoe sap root combo (at -50% dmg/speed its the strongest sap in the game as far as im aware, while being aoe) you end up with an unstoppable force of nature.

 

Like come on, we're talking seeker levels of dmg reduction, sometimes even higher, for 0 cost. To put it in perspective, seekers sacrifice 70% of their max hp to achieve that. On top of that, chiefs have rogue/bd levels of single target burst, with a resist longer than mages all the while having the fastest movement speed in the game. On top of passively applying bleeds to anyone who dares to come close. Then you sprinkle in the strongest aoe sap in the game and add root effect to it, and for funsies add extremely high aoe capability(because why not). All of this on one class.

 

You can't cc them, you can't burst them, you can't even run away from them and you can't even catch them if they find themselves in a risky situations. What's the counter play here?

 

It's way too much for one single class.

Edited November 27, 2023 by vavavi

[Sandels 8]

2 minutes ago, vavavi said:

You can't cc them, you can't burst them, you can't even run away from them and you can't even catch them if they find themselves in a risky situations. What's the counter play here?

if you look at any youtube videos where thyere fighting against these "broken" chieftains, often orci ones, you see theyre completely beatable with some of the videos having even like 90% winrate vs them when you just have a proper team. 

 

6 minutes ago, vavavi said:

It's way too much for one single class.

thats why i said, if they take something away from chief, they gotta add it to other classes cause only chief can match majority of elf classes properly. For the root, it barely ever even works in small fights due to reaction relic existing and the chief having long resist giving everyone endless free reaction relics.

 

9 minutes ago, vavavi said:

Like come on, we're talking seeker levels of dmg reduction, sometimes even higher, for 0 cost

which you can still get through if you have proper dmg like a bd or seeker for example. I did say that making it flat 50-55% and removing the increase based on lost hp would make a huge difference already to their tankiness at low hp and making it alot easier to finish them off.

[Sandels 8]

14 minutes ago, vavavi said:

permanently immune to stuns

No, i mentioned that you get down to like 40% resist before being able to reuse the skill even on resist buffs unless you got like every possible CD boosting tool with you to get to like 160%+ CD, alot of chiefs often die before being able to even use their 2nd resist. to even get the extra 4s from cleansing debuffs in the first place

[Sandels 8]

19 minutes ago, vavavi said:

You're looking at every skill individually. Yes, if you look at one skill or aspect of the class at a time there is no issue. The issue is the combination from all of these.

And yes, everything combined theyre strong if you have orci book. Some changes could be made to rework some of the skills in the way that they would not be affected by the book anymore, other than that i really dont see what can you do. You simply cant nerf the whole class to the extremes due to, in EU case there being 3 chieftains you kind of struggle with( not that they even completely make you unable to do anything as we seen from various arena seasons where theres orci chiefs demanding and you still do fine) and everyone else you wipe the floor with easily.

[vavavi 240]

50 minutes ago, Sandels said:

if you look at any youtube videos where thyere fighting against these "broken" chieftains, often orci ones, you see theyre completely beatable with some of the videos having even like 90% winrate vs them when you just have a proper team. 

 

thats why i said, if they take something away from chief, they gotta add it to other classes cause only chief can match majority of elf classes properly. For the root, it barely ever even works in small fights due to reaction relic existing and the chief having long resist giving everyone endless free reaction relics.

 

which you can still get through if you have proper dmg like a bd or seeker for example. I did say that making it flat 50-55% and removing the increase based on lost hp would make a huge difference already to their tankiness at low hp and making it alot easier to finish them off.

Orcinus book simply takes the already existing issues to a ridiculous extreme. The issues exist without it too.

 

46 minutes ago, Sandels said:

No, i mentioned that you get down to like 40% resist before being able to reuse the skill even on resist buffs unless you got like every possible CD boosting tool with you to get to like 160%+ CD, alot of chiefs often die before being able to even use their 2nd resist. to even get the extra 4s from cleansing debuffs in the first place

You cut out the part where i said its at the very least a cycle of permanent resist/dmg reduction.

 

40 minutes ago, Sandels said:

And yes, everything combined theyre strong if you have orci book. Some changes could be made to rework some of the skills in the way that they would not be affected by the book anymore, other than that i really dont see what can you do. You simply cant nerf the whole class to the extremes due to, in EU case there being 3 chieftains you kind of struggle with( not that they even completely make you unable to do anything as we seen from various arena seasons where theres orci chiefs demanding and you still do fine) and everyone else you wipe the floor with easily.

Eu situation is different. The mc side in eu lacks the leadership, unity or just general interest to even try and compete. It ends up being one mc pty with the chieftain wiping the floor with every pty, while elf spam parties avoid it and spam while it's inside arena. You can look at other more active servers and see how it is there.

Heres BR server for example.

[Sandels 8]

26 minutes ago, vavavi said:

Orcinus book simply takes the already existing issues to a ridiculous extreme. The issues exist without it too

No, it doesnt and the its proven by the fact that 99% of the complaints you see, concentrate around specific people every single time. Theres lots of fully booked chiefs in EU, yet theyre never mentioned anywhere cause they actually dont bring you much trouble.

27 minutes ago, vavavi said:

You cut out the part where i said its at the very least a cycle of permanent resist/dmg reduction

yes, you are supposed to cycle them and without those 2 skills being somewhat the way they are, the whole class would be completely and utterly useless.

 

33 minutes ago, vavavi said:

Heres BR server for example

Just showing an ss of arena ranks tells nothing about the class´s actual performance, i dont even know if anyone is actively fighting those guys for the ranks, and with what teams. Theres been times in EU when theres like 6 or 7templars in top 10, does that mean templars are broken in every way imaginable and unbeatable? No.

 

The whole point with the complaints about chieftains is that theyre always backed with nothing to even discuss apart from orci book orci book orci book, no actual proper reasoning or logic behind the rant.

 

1 hour ago, Sandels said:

if you look at any youtube videos where thyere fighting against these "broken" chieftains, often orci ones, you see theyre completely beatable with some of the videos having even like 90% winrate vs them when you just have a proper team.

You also ignored this completely, for reasons unknown. Theres literally videos of people beating chiefs, often orci ones with like up to 90% winrate but yet you speak as if they were some insane monster of a class and impossible to be deal with while its certainly not the case.

[Sandels 8]

3 hours ago, vavavi said:

It ends up being one mc pty with the chieftain wiping the floor with every pty

Logically, to beat the best of mcs, you need the best of elves. And when you have those people demanding, theres been no trouble especially now with new talents and bracelets. Weak elves cant win best mc pvp people, weak mcs cant beat the best elf pvp people, simple as that. Could mention here that i believe the only mc pts ive seen that have a reasonable, 50-50 chance of beating a top tier elf pt, are with orci chiefs, wonder why it requires a broken orci chief to put up a match to alot of elf pts. And no, the chief aint even winning, more like 50-50 if its best vs best.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Sandels

[Daniel Paulo 32]

On 15/11/2023 at 17:02, Jaan said:

Magic Chief é feito para lutas em massa, não para arena. se você quer ser bom na arena, opte pelo set físico. O dano que um chefe mágico causa em lutas gvg/mass é muito alto e você quer mais, você claramente é um usuário chefe, certo? você quer mais dano do que isso? isso é apenas de um chefe. Agora imagine que há mais de 30 deles com seu AoE empilhado e você está pedindo mais?







 

Firstly, on my server the elf side has guilds that always beat mcs, so this damage is not exaggerated.  Secondly, the damage to gvgs is mainly from the skill "Violent Army and Eye of the Eagle", I asked to increase the damage in explosive damage skills basically, this does not affect gvg.  Don't tell me what I have to do to be good in the arena gringo, personally I'm already good enough and there are a few magic chiefs who are full gz, I just want my class to be worthy in the arena, just as a wizard is in the arena and in gvg too .  The problem is the physical chief, who with his exaggerated physical damage, like other classes, kill strong players in a single attack, and combining the chief's resistance, he becomes overpowered, but the problem is his damage, because the resistance of the Chief, if nerfed, could end the class and the legion.

[Daniel Paulo 32]

On 24/11/2023 at 07:24, N629 said:

1º É grande mentira phsc chief hitkill players

Chefe do segundo phsc fazendo dano, mas não consegue se curar perfeitamente

Mas o chefe mahic pode curar perfeitamente, mas não pode causar dano, pois é melhor o phsc encontrar um novo, sugerir melhor do que matar os chefes do phsc, ele já está nerfado

good physical chiefs, use a cloth set and can have up to 500 magical damage, with that relic that increases healing by 40%, they heal well too, in addition to having leather too.  But the problem is not the chief's resistance, the problem is the resistance added to the physical chief's damage.