Sandels

To be fair, only chief due to resist, being able to eat a few hits and heal can tank a good seeker for even few seconds and perhaps hunter if its not in invis, can even tank a top tier seeker for even the duration of their stuns, barb can probably tank till the stuns are over but has no dmg to outdmg a seekers heals from ls, skills or pots scrolls. Aswell as if you dare to stun the seeker, they heal FULL amount from distos, making the job even harder.

you see them everyday in arenas and other places and youd be surprised how many of them are actually booked, its just that if its not a chief, they die just as fast with 15 books as with 0 cause they have no counterplay to elves. Theres a reason why you only really see orci chiefs in fights when things get hard, and the reason is that other classes simply cant do a thing against good elves no matter if theyre booked or not. And that is exactly why i say, if they decide to nerf chief, they better buff the shit outta other mc classes or theres no hope for mc.

well, perhaps you know what i mean. there is actually lots of booked people in mc side, they just dont stand out from the rest due to the classes being overall, one could say, bad. But nevertheless, sure.

idk, never seen them tank for a long time like wardens and palas that can go for up to a minute easily and if its just 1 guy hitting them, pretty much forever until trash enough luck or they kill the guy hitting them. dont know whether or not you got all the newest talents on your fresh bd either. I see maxed out, even booked dks just get deleted in a matter of seconds when people actually focus them. Feel free to try to catch a clip vs a dk to prove me wrong, a fair one at that, for example you with 0 buffs taking a while to kill a fully buffed dk is not a fair comparison.

not vs an equal strength of enemy granted its a class that has any dmg.

if the dk is equal to you in strength (equips, amps, books) it is not hard at all to kill them, and obviously using buffs that work well vs them. Yes if youre a "normal" guy with normal pvp gear and perhaps not using buffs and you go fight a +10 greatness dk who is on full buffs and perhaps has books, its gonna be hard. But when everything is equal, its not.

i see dks getting deleted from existence in 5 seconds by any good seekers, bds, mages, beastmasters, anything that has good dmg and if they use their best tank setups possible, they can tank for perhaps another 5 seconds while losing every other ability they would otherwise have.

Make chief less tanky but give it something else to work with then sure. If you only nerf the tankiness without adding anything to cover that loss, they will be unusable. Reduce the tankiness in big fights but give better ranged abilitites or ways to survive, fair enough. But it should be noted that chief is the only class in mc that can do work in smaller fights vs elves which should be kept in mind. Chief is the only class that can go face to face melee battle with bd or seeker without immediately dying, Its really the only class that has any counterplay or chance of winning vs any team of the top elf pvp classes in smaller fights like bd, beastmaster, pala, seeker, druid, you name it. Only chief can put up a match vs those mainly due to being able to survive for more than 2 seconds when they catch you. Reducing the tankiness would mean either other mc classes needing to be heavily buffed to put up a fight or all the elves being nerfed to the ground which is unlikely.

Mc tanks are extremely bad at their job, theyre often the ones dying 1st, last wish saves a barb for 8 secs if the skill is even ready from cooldown and thats it, dk cant even get to the frontline in the first place due to having worst movement ingame and cant move 2 yards from any cross. So someone has to do the job dont you think? Chief is quite literally the ONLY class in whole mc side that can tank even a little bit in big fights, everyone else dies the moment an enemy manages to hit them once. 1. Chief does way less single target burst dmg than a bd, seeker or a reaper. Reapers hit for alot more than chiefs, seekers hit 2k and 4k talent hits with AUTO HITS hits to maxed players, even tanks. Bds deal double the dmg with their skills and way more with autos compared to chief. On a chief if you see wolf doing above 2k its a miracle. Frenzy does like 2.5k in total at best if all 5 hits land and the enemy is a cloth user. Sure you can apply some bleeds, but theyre dots therefore way easier to counter since you actually have time to heal and support before they slowly damage you. Might i add that bd can instantly apply 2 bleeds which is equivalent to 4 or more chief bleeds due to doing well over double the dmg compared to chief bleeds, also the chief requiring a minimum of like 10 seconds being there in melee range to even apply them. 2. How hard is it to understand that you CANNOT do both simultaneously on chief. You either have alot of aoe dmg with magic, or you have alot of single target dmg with phys. You cannot have everything at the same time. Aswell the fact that a non orci book user or fully booked chief does not even have the option to go physical in big fights, they do not have the tankiness to be able to survive. Physical makes it alot harder to tank but with the help of orci book and certain builds it can be somewhat doable although still way less tanky than a magic user. Neither can chief, they can tank when you got other people giving you several buffs including shaman dmg reduction, yes while having 100% dmg redu you logically will not die for the duration. An orci one can do some work alone, but they arent invincible and also die the moment some enemies actually focus their dmg on them. And unless youre fully booked you will die if you try to go in middle of enemies, as you should. Sure a 15 book chieftain will be able to tank a little better, but will also die quick. Same way theres fully booked mages and bds in EU who can go frontline and certainly do their part in the fight before, if even dying. I already explained somewhere to you why chiefs sometimes get tanky and its purely due to lifesteal and rage/guild fury effects. Switching swooping into a single big hit and/or perhaps removing the extra dmg reduction based on lost hp from rugged while increasing the base to like 50-55% would already make a huge impact, even if it was just the rugged change and nothing done to swooping, you dont play chief so you just cant see that.

Logically, to beat the best of mcs, you need the best of elves. And when you have those people demanding, theres been no trouble especially now with new talents and bracelets. Weak elves cant win best mc pvp people, weak mcs cant beat the best elf pvp people, simple as that. Could mention here that i believe the only mc pts ive seen that have a reasonable, 50-50 chance of beating a top tier elf pt, are with orci chiefs, wonder why it requires a broken orci chief to put up a match to alot of elf pts. And no, the chief aint even winning, more like 50-50 if its best vs best.

No, it doesnt and the its proven by the fact that 99% of the complaints you see, concentrate around specific people every single time. Theres lots of fully booked chiefs in EU, yet theyre never mentioned anywhere cause they actually dont bring you much trouble. yes, you are supposed to cycle them and without those 2 skills being somewhat the way they are, the whole class would be completely and utterly useless. Just showing an ss of arena ranks tells nothing about the class´s actual performance, i dont even know if anyone is actively fighting those guys for the ranks, and with what teams. Theres been times in EU when theres like 6 or 7templars in top 10, does that mean templars are broken in every way imaginable and unbeatable? No. The whole point with the complaints about chieftains is that theyre always backed with nothing to even discuss apart from orci book orci book orci book, no actual proper reasoning or logic behind the rant. You also ignored this completely, for reasons unknown. Theres literally videos of people beating chiefs, often orci ones with like up to 90% winrate but yet you speak as if they were some insane monster of a class and impossible to be deal with while its certainly not the case.

chiefs are designed for it though, thats why all of their dmg is melee range except 1 skill. the same way mages are except mage can actually use alot of skills from range still and got no penalty like chief that loses half of its kit when going either phys or magic dmg. And you have no idea how bad barb and dk are, they are completely paper unlike warden and pala who can atleast heal properly and got good dmg reduction, not to mention passively heal aswell. One skill, swooping army, thats it. Rat is out of the question as its bad.

Nobody forces seekers to use it, but you forgot that their dmg gets practically doubled by it, missed just a small detail but nvm i guess. Its a low def frontline class with no other ways to negate dmg apart from that 1 skill, i find it reasonable while it being flat 50% practically nerfs the skill by like 30% overall already.

And yes, everything combined theyre strong if you have orci book. Some changes could be made to rework some of the skills in the way that they would not be affected by the book anymore, other than that i really dont see what can you do. You simply cant nerf the whole class to the extremes due to, in EU case there being 3 chieftains you kind of struggle with( not that they even completely make you unable to do anything as we seen from various arena seasons where theres orci chiefs demanding and you still do fine) and everyone else you wipe the floor with easily.

No, i mentioned that you get down to like 40% resist before being able to reuse the skill even on resist buffs unless you got like every possible CD boosting tool with you to get to like 160%+ CD, alot of chiefs often die before being able to even use their 2nd resist. to even get the extra 4s from cleansing debuffs in the first place