vavavi

This was cool to read. Reminds me of that comic app that used to exist for some lore.

Oh wow, book rewards are back, nice.

Yea, exactly. That's the exact thing that separates cloth users from tanks. You're not suppoed to be one. When you put these % of dmg reduction on a class meant to do that, they're massive. In other words, the issue isn't withing the skills itself, just that you're trying to get perks for locks that contradict the classes design. Reading that was like a bad poem, idk what you're trying to say. But I didn't say locks damage reduction is op, just that comparatively the dmg reduction skills the class has are pretty strong. Also, bracelets affected every magic user, not just warlocks. Maybe the issue once again isn't in the class itself, but rather the core design philosophy of the game shifting a little. Clearly the developers felt magic damage and control effects being lowered as something that was necessary. If thats the case, then buffing one class over every other affected would be weird at best.

It's not like locks don't already have lots of defensive skills, they're extremely tanky for a cloth class. Tankier than most of them. Having to exchange some of their offensive capabilities for defensive ones, like locks 3rd brsnch, is normal. Most classes have this option. Why should it come for free for locks? Locks already have so much damage reduction, if you add even more you'll soon turn a cloth user into a tank class. Locks can already reach warden forti levels of damage reduction (Fortification is 30% at 4/4, locks get 20% passive from power of relaxation talent, and 12,5% at max from draining life skill) and get passive heals. How is that not enough survivability for an offensive cloth user?

Give locks a talent that gives them a 6 sec resist, but forces them to use circle/silence zone only on top of their own character.

I said single target for a reason. Also resisting and jumping in isn't that viable. Resist is only 6 secs, barely enough time to get another jump ready. And even if you do manage that, you still have to go close, locks don't. They can just use their stuns from miles away without ever having to step into the fight. Hence having far less need for defensive capabilities, they are supposed to be at their weakest when caught. I didn't complain about rogues. I was saying they aren't as bad as everyone kept saying while using clips of being deleted to back that up. Theres a pretty clear difference between saying something isn't bad and saying something is overpowered.

There really isn't some high chance. Not missing circles, or any other "on the floor" - type aoe is not that difficult. Never has been, never will be. You shouldn't be comparing locks dmg to dedicated damagers. Bds, seekeers, rogues, reapers and whatever else are in a comoletely different category. A cc focused class using them as a comparison point for their damage is just simply looking at it wrong. Compared to their closest counterpart, mage, locks do far more single target damage. Also, once more, doesn't sound like its an issue of not having defensive utility. It's you choosing to not sacrifice any offensive capabilities to use it. The tools are there, you're just not using them. You think defensive skills like mages barrier or sun armor come free with no skill points used? You have heals instead of skills like a dodge buff? And once again, there is a passive dmg reduction available, but according to your own words, you're just choosing to not use it. A mage can't be played from a safe range though, what are you talking about? Their single target dmg isn't that great, and even to do that to an effective level, you need to get within melee range to use your skills. These defensive buffs are required when your range is taken away. If warlocks could only cast circle and silence zone underneath themselves, would agree that they need a def buff aswell. It's only "over' against damagers that resist. Same goes for basically every caster, if your stuns are resisted at a bad time by a high damage class, you just die. This isn't a lock specific thing. Besides, you have a passive dmg reduction in the form of a talent, that can't be cancelled by resists. On top of having a panic button in stone. Even if such a defensive skill would be added, it would require an investment of skill points. Which would cause you to lose out in offensive capabilities. And judging from what I've read from other people in this thread, having to sacrifice any skill points or offensive utility to use your defensive tools is a big nono. So I guess you want locks to get yet another defensive utility buff, but it has to be completely free of skill points/changing any offensive utility? Crazy.

Thats true, they don't have a skill like mages sun armor. But in my opinion they honestly don't need it. The impact the class can have in fights of any size (except like 1v1/2v2s where it isn't the best) is massive. A class with such high impact, that can be applied from a safe range, shouldn't also be a tank.

Oh come on, if you genuinely cant aim a 3x3 stun with a talent that even gives you a chance to extend that range, thats a issue on the players part, not the class. It really isn't that difficult. And yea it isn't the same thing, but both points of view are equally as important. If you only ever asked the users of one class if its balanced they would always just ask for it to be buffed. Both perspectives are required. You have passive dmg reduction from power of relaxation talent, that doesn't count as defensive? Also skills that boost your heals, and stone? You're exaggerating alot. You have a class that can become the highest single target magic damager, or a class with best crowd control in the game. You think just because you cant have both at the same time it makes the class weak? That's crazy, you're not supposed to have everything at once. You talk like no other class relys on their stuns and debuffs to be viable, like it's just a warlock problem. Templars, druids, priests, palas, reapers, rogues, hunters, charmers etc etc all suffer from people having high resist. This isn't some class specific thing. Locks just happen to be the only class that has actual tools to counter it.

Priests cleanse talent, if in party, can be used up by the other party members on any random sap, bleed or slow. Would prefer it worked the same way as necros does where it's only focused on one person you choose, but thats for a different topic. Besides, warlocks aren't the only class that suffer from people resisting, thats basically every class. They actually are the only class that has the tools to avoid those resists. Other classes don't have a -35% resist talent you know? Locks are fortunate in that sense.

It is a place for discussion though. Instead of you saying anything related to the topic you just decided to start insulting. Wasn't surprising, but still . Playing against them is equally valid experience of the class. If balance discussions only happened between the players of the class in question nothing sensible would ever come out of it. Yea well thats the thing, I've experienced playing against them, while you have experienced playing as one. These are 2 equally valid view points. And from my experience they are very difficult to deal with when played right and can win an arena fight with one well placed circle/silence zone.

It's not nonsense though. Damagers kill every caster fast, this isn't something unique to warlocks. Cloth users aren't meant to tank. Pretty easily actually. Warlocks do high dmg with alot of cc at their disposal. Also any lower dmg class will struggle to kill them through their damage reduction and heals. Also I wasn't complaining, just pointed out the fact that locks heal too much for priests to be able to deal with them. If you somehow survive the stuns to even try to kill them in the first place. That is just what damagers do. Just because bladedancers dmg is through the roof currently and should be toned down, doesn't mean that other damagers aren't capable of doing the same thing to cloth users. Barbs, hunters, rangers, seekers, rogues all dispatch of most cloth users easily, that's what they're meant to do. While cloth users, such as warlocks, aren't meant to tank these classes. Also it's the forum, everyones allowed to discuss and chime into topics, me included. That doesn't change just because someone has an opinion that's different from yours.

That talent is only useful in a 1v1 situation though, and even then it removes random bleeds and relics more often than actual stuns. Necro has a similiar one, but far stronger since he can avoid party taking the removals. Also priests just do t have the dmg to kill a wlock, they heal too much as is. And once more, these are things that happen in 1v1 situations, whether a class is balanced or not shouldn't be judged from those. In arena/mass fights locks are still one of the best classes by far

Bd and ranger just are very big counters to warlocks. The same way hunters/reapers kill elf casters easily. You're supposed to have classes that counter you. Warlocks counter multiple classes heavily too; priests, paladins, templars, druids and alot of the time mages have no way to deal with warlocks. Is it fair to say that makes wlocks op? Natural counters just exist to each class

Personally i find mages easy to kill on a priest while bladedancers not so much, but yes, that could also be because I'm not playing correctly against them. It all changes situation to situation, theres so many variables that play into each encounter; player skill, gears, which class counters which, relics, resist procs etc. As for warlocks, yes there are some classes that almost hard counter them, but theres also classes that get countered by locks too. It's how balance should work. If theres one class that rises above every other class then it's a balance issue, while if a class, in this case warlock, can't beat some classes, thats just the game working as intended. That's the way it should be for every class.